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22/11/2018 12:10 pm
Thanks Jboldman and Bilter. Bilter, I'm afraid that the link leads to to a web page that can't be found . Could you reference those articles for us?
"The medals don't mean anything and the glory doesn't last. It's all about your happiness. The rewards are going to come, but my happiness is just loving the sport and having fun performing" ~ Jackie Joyner Kersee.
Topic starter 22/11/2018 12:44 pm
Sorry, seems my other link is bit off also although at least it does relate to the subject matter.
Try these:
nolva:
Green tea:
there are more studies out there on GT but I no medical journal based studies. Probably due to the fact that it is not a patentable compund.
Please note, most studies on Tamaxifin are on mice or post menapuasal women. Hopefully the results carry over to men and men on aas.
If these links don't work PM me & I will try to email what I have to anyone that is interested.
22/11/2018 1:43 pm
Bilter, is the abstract below the one that you were trying to reference?
Banerjee S, Smith IE, Folkerd L, Iqbal J, Barker P, Dowsett M; IMPACT trialists. Comparative effects of anastrozole, tamoxifen alone and in combination on plasma lipids and bone-derived resorption during neoadjuvant therapy in the impact trial. Ann Oncol. 2005;16(10):1632-8.
ABSTRACT
BACKGROUND: Estrogen has beneficial effects on lipid metabolism and bone preservation. The IMPACT trial evaluated neoadjuvant therapy with Anastrozole or tamoxifen alone, or a combination. The comparative effects of these treatments on serum lipids and bone resorption were assessed. PATIENTS AND METHODS: Non-fasting clotted blood samples were taken from 176 postmenopausal patients at baseline, 2 and 12 weeks for assessment of serum levels of estradiol, the bone resorption marker CTx and lipid profiles [total cholesterol (TC), high density lipoprotein cholesterol (HDL-C) and non-HDL cholesterol (N-HDL-C)]. RESULTS: After 12 weeks, tamoxifen was associated with a significant increase in HDL-C (26.5%), and a decrease in TC (6.5%) and N-HDL-C (12.3%). Anastrozole was associated with a significant increase in HDL-C (11.2%), and a non-significant increase in TC (2.9%) and N-HDL-C (3.4%), both of which were significantly different from tamoxifen. The combination was associated with a significant increase in HDL-C (9.4%), and a decrease in TC (10.9%) and N-HDL-C (13.9%). For tamoxifen and the combination, there were non-significant decreases in CTx compared with a significant increase (45.6%) with anastrozole. No correlation between serum estradiol and CTx was seen in any of the treatment groups. CONCLUSION: Anastrozole did not have a detrimental effect on lipid profiles following 3 months of therapy. There was a significant increase in CTx with anastrozole in contrast to tamoxifen.
"The medals don't mean anything and the glory doesn't last. It's all about your happiness. The rewards are going to come, but my happiness is just loving the sport and having fun performing" ~ Jackie Joyner Kersee.
Topic starter 22/11/2018 2:37 pm
yes sir! that is the one.
Topic starter 22/11/2018 3:12 pm
one more thing for those that are intersested. Tomorrow, I will be going to get some blood work done HDL, LDL, Triglicerides, homocistein (sp?), pst as well as test levels and anything else the Dr throws in. But these are the ones I am most interested in. I am 40yo, clean now for over 3 yrs, workin out for 25 and looking at starting a new cycle in 1 week or so. Plan on having more blood work done (maybe during) but def after cycle and utilizing all of the above methods for healthy lipids. This will be my first real life test to see what effects they have on me.
Topic starter 22/11/2018 4:10 pm
Reults are in, and I must say I am quite pleased. TC came in at 211 (a bit high) BUT! HDL - 82! Very happy with that, LDL-108, VLDL-21, trygl-104. Dr says I am "genetically blessed". I would rather think that it has nore to do with my diet, supps and physical activity. The next thing will be to see how a cycle effects everything. I have the same feeling one gets when you just washed you car and are preparing to drive it through a large mud hole.
22/11/2018 4:51 pm
Good! And keep us updated on your coming cycle.
"The medals don't mean anything and the glory doesn't last. It's all about your happiness. The rewards are going to come, but my happiness is just loving the sport and having fun performing" ~ Jackie Joyner Kersee.
Topic starter 22/11/2018 5:31 pm
Good! And keep us updated on your coming cycle.
sure thing. I think I'll see a diff doc though if I have a lipid test done during. I asked for a test for test levels and had to answer a whole lotta ? as to why I wanted it done. The answer that "I'm 40 and I know that they decline with age" didn't cut it. I want it because I apy the bill and that is what I want finally go the message across. I shoudl have the results on that test, the PSA and homosistien levels next week.
22/11/2018 6:16 pm
You need to find yourself a good "anti-aging" Dr. near you.
- RR
" Go hard or go home !"
"Lightweight baby!"
22/11/2018 6:53 pm
You need to find yourself a good "anti-aging" Dr. near you.
Indeed!
"The medals don't mean anything and the glory doesn't last. It's all about your happiness. The rewards are going to come, but my happiness is just loving the sport and having fun performing" ~ Jackie Joyner Kersee.
22/11/2018 7:49 pm
HMG-CoA reductase inhibitors AKA Statins are great for lowering total Colesterol and LDL. It is not somehting that should be taken wihtout any monitoring of liver tests during a steroid cycle. Red yeast rice can do the same job as the statin with potientially less adverse effects on the liver. Depending on the anabolic susbstance(s) used, combination with statin may not be safe for the liver. Niacin (especially non-flsh) may also raise the LFTs, but not as likely as statins. Fish oil or other sources of omega 3 fatty acis (ie flax seed oil) is an excellent supplement to help with the lipid profile. Policosanol is promising but most of the published studies come out of Cuba. Are we getting the same formualtion in the US? Many studies indicate that letrozole may be more lipid friendly thatn anastrozole...
22/11/2018 8:25 pm
The most frequent side effects related to statins are myopathy (Ucar et al. 2000; Anfossi et al. 2004; Hansen et al. 2005), rhabdomyolysis (Ucar et al. 2000; Hansen et al. 2005; Iskra et al. 2005) and hepatic toxicity (Heuer et at. 2000; Lazebnik et al. 2003; Anfossi et al. 2004) which is also called statin hepatitis (Lazebnik et al. 2003).
Occasionally, arthralgia, alone or in association with myalgia, has been reported (Ucar et al. 2000). On the other hand, significant myopathy is rare with an incidence of less than 0.5% of patients. The same authors also reported that progression of myalgia or myositis to rhabdomyolysis is rare (one in 30-100 000 patient-years of exposure), but if progressive muscle symptoms are ignored then fatalities can occur. This data is corroborated by Vasudevan et al. (2005) who reported that although statin drugs can have adverse effects on muscles and the liver, these effects are uncommon, but caution is warranted in patients at higher risk (ie, those who are elderly, frail, or small; have multisystem disease; are receiving immunosuppressive drugs or other medications that interact with statins; or are receiving higher doses of a statin).
Regarding the prevalence of statin-induced hepatic toxicity, Anfossi et al. (2004) reported that it occurs in 1-3% of patients.
Statin side effects may be dose-related (Anfossi et al. 2004; Mukhtar & Reckless 2005), associated with other drug interactions that interfere with statin metabolic pathways through cytochrome p450 pathways or glucuronidation, or related to co-morbidities (Mukhtar & Reckless 2005). Likewise, Ucar et al. (2000) alert that electrolyte disturbances, infections, major trauma, hypoxia as well as drugs of abuse may increase the risk of myotoxicity.
Finally, usually adverse events revert after dosage reduction or treatment withdrawal (cessation of statin therapy) (Heuer et at. 2000; Anfossi et al. 2004; Hansen et al. 2005).
In my opinion, statins should be only used under medical supervision who can monitor liver and muscles enzimes. In addition, when prescribing statins, physicians should be alert to potential risks and educate patients to report any potentially significant symptoms.
References:
Anfossi G, Massucco P, Bonomo K, Trovati M. Prescription of statins to dyslipidemic patients affected by liver diseases: a subtle balance between risks and benefits. Nutr Metab Cardiovasc Dis. 2004;14(4):215-24.
Hansen KE, Hildebrand JP, Ferguson EE, Stein JH. Outcomes in 45 patients with statin-associated myopathy. Arch Intern Med. 2005;165(22):2671-6.
Heuer T, Gerards H, Pauw M, Gabbert HE, Reis HE. Toxic liver damage caused by HMG-CoA reductase inhibitor. Med Klin (Munich). 2000;95(11):642-4.
Iskra B, Zivko M, Kes P. Rhabdomyolysis as a side effect of simvastatin treatment. Acta Med Croatica. 2005;59(4):325-8.
Lazebnik LB, Zvenigorodskaia LA, Morozov IA, Shepeleva SD. Clinicomorphological changes of liver in atherogenic dyslipidemia and after treatment with statins. Ter Arkh. 2003;75(8):51-5.
Mukhtar RY, Reckless JP. Statin-induced myositis: a commonly encountered or rare side effect? Curr Opin Lipidol. 2005;16(6):640-7.
Vasudevan AR, Hamirani YS, Jones PH. Safety of statins: effects on muscle and the liver. Cleve Clin J Med. 2005;72(11):990-3, 996-1001.
Ucar M, Mjorndal T, Dahlqvist R. HMG-CoA reductase inhibitors and myotoxicity. Drug Saf. 2000;22(6):441-57.
"The medals don't mean anything and the glory doesn't last. It's all about your happiness. The rewards are going to come, but my happiness is just loving the sport and having fun performing" ~ Jackie Joyner Kersee.
22/11/2018 8:58 pm
Superbly informative reference thread. Thanks for that guys!
Topic starter 22/11/2018 9:40 pm
Well, got my test level results back today. Came in at 353. They did not give me a brak down. I've been searching the net trying to find out what is "normal". Best I can come up with is 300-1200 so it looks like I'm on the lower end of normal. Still waiting on the homosistien levels, will report when I get them
25/11/2018 5:28 pm
How old are you?
"The medals don't mean anything and the glory doesn't last. It's all about your happiness. The rewards are going to come, but my happiness is just loving the sport and having fun performing" ~ Jackie Joyner Kersee.